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DMX secured his legacy as one of hip-hop’s greats throughout the late ’90s into the 2000s. His aggressive style of rapping made him a singular figure within the scene, but his connection to hip-hop went deeper than that. It wasn’t just about the rapping.

During an interview with All Hip Hop about two decades ago, DMX reflected on the nature of hip-hop. He made it clear that, while rapping obviously forms a key part of it, hip-hop is actually much more than that—and it was thriving, even in his day, after its supposed “golden age” had ended.

“For people to say hip-hop is dead, that means they don’t know what the fuck they are talking about,” he said. “Hip-hop is a lifestyle.”

Rap, from DMX’s perspective, is an expression of hip-hop culture, but it is far from the only one. “Rap is the music of hip-hop,” he said. “Graffiti is the art. Breakdancing is the dance. It’s a lifestyle. It’s not fuckin’ music.”

Clearly the contention that hip-hop was dying during the 2000s annoyed DMX, and, to be fair, it seems he was right. Hip-hop has certainly changed since its golden age, but to claim it’s dead would be absurd. It is a core part of the mainstream today, while there are countless scenes and subgenres within it all over the world.

DMX could see the vitality of hip-hop, even as some were declaring its demise. “Hip-hop isn’t dead,” he stated unambiguously. “You can’t kill this. We’re like three generations deep in here. You can’t be serious.”

The hardcore rapper was in a strong position to comment on the state of hip-hop. Not only was he a leading force within it during the 2000s, around the time he was giving this interview, but he had been there since the very start. Right as hip-hop started to break into the wider culture, he considered himself to be a part of it.

DMX recalled the first time he ever heard a rap song on the radio, which happened while he was visiting an injured friend. “My man was in the hospital and he had got stabbed up,” he recalled. “And he was like, ‘Yo, sonny, come here they about to play the first rap record on the radio.’”

He and his friend listened to the music that played. First up was a song by the funk and disco group the Fatback Band, but he didn’t specifically mention what the track was. It is possible that it was ‘King Tim III (Personality Jock),’ released in 1979, which is widely considered to be the first recorded hip-hop song. It preceded the Sugarhill Gang’s ‘Rapper’s Delight’ by several months, which, in turn, is considered to be the first commercially released hip-hop song.

Whether or not the Fatback Band song that DMX and his friend heard on the radio really was ‘King Tim III (Personality Jock)’ is unclear, but he did specifically say that ‘Rapper’s Delight’ was the second song that they listened to. His friend, somehow, had gotten wind that the radio was about to play this early example of hip-hop music. “How the fuck he found out they was about to play that shit?” DMX asked. “I have no idea!”

This experience clearly meant a lot to DMX, and it was the start of his own journey within hip-hop. “I been with rap since the beginning,” he said. “Hip-hop existed before rap. I’ve followed since it came out.”